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	<title>Comments on: Genocide Notes</title>
	<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/</link>
	<description>Journalism and Photography from Armenia and the Surrounding Region</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 05:25:55 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=1.5.1-alpha</generator>

	<item>
		<title>by: Observer</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4791</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Oct 2007 19:38:00 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4791</guid>
					<description>OK - will try that next time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>OK - will try that next time.
</p>
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		<title>by: Onnik</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4786</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Oct 2007 00:10:01 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4786</guid>
					<description>BTW: Observer, try as I might I can't turn on automatic detection of inbound links i.e. automatic trackbacks so when you link to a post I'd really suggest manually typing in the trackback url given at the bottom of each post in the field provided in your wordpress post page.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>BTW: Observer, try as I might I can&#8217;t turn on automatic detection of inbound links i.e. automatic trackbacks so when you link to a post I&#8217;d really suggest manually typing in the trackback url given at the bottom of each post in the field provided in your wordpress post page.
</p>
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		<title>by: Nanul</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4785</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 23:53:52 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4785</guid>
					<description>Turkey recalls its ambassador for consultations. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Turkey recalls its ambassador for consultations.
</p>
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		<title>by: Paul</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4784</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 23:47:48 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4784</guid>
					<description>The Turkish politicians have been spounting off quite a few doozies when it comes in the form of quotes. Not too good with words, they should just leave it to their paid lobbists to do that for them. Best example: 

&quot;Yesterday some in Congress wanted to play hardball,&quot; said Egemen Bagis, foreign policy adviser to Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan. &quot;I can assure you Turkey knows how to play hardball.&quot;

Yes, it does, like how about killing 1.5 million Armenians for example (and having the gaul to deny it 90 years in the face of worldwide acknowledgement of it being a historical truth).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>The Turkish politicians have been spounting off quite a few doozies when it comes in the form of quotes. Not too good with words, they should just leave it to their paid lobbists to do that for them. Best example: </p>
	<p>&#8220;Yesterday some in Congress wanted to play hardball,&#8221; said Egemen Bagis, foreign policy adviser to Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan. &#8220;I can assure you Turkey knows how to play hardball.&#8221;</p>
	<p>Yes, it does, like how about killing 1.5 million Armenians for example (and having the gaul to deny it 90 years in the face of worldwide acknowledgement of it being a historical truth).
</p>
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	<item>
		<title>by: Observer</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4783</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 23:38:20 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4783</guid>
					<description>There was a wave of posts in the Armenian blogosphere, mostly in Russian, which I'm still struggling through, and will make a post of translated extracts as soon as I have a minute to catch my breath.

My personal first-reaction was to look and see what Armenian media are up to - and the post can be found &lt;a href=&quot;http://ditord.wordpress.com/2007/10/11/genocide-resolution-in-us-congress-in-center-of-armenian-media-attention/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>There was a wave of posts in the Armenian blogosphere, mostly in Russian, which I&#8217;m still struggling through, and will make a post of translated extracts as soon as I have a minute to catch my breath.</p>
	<p>My personal first-reaction was to look and see what Armenian media are up to - and the post can be found <a href="http://ditord.wordpress.com/2007/10/11/genocide-resolution-in-us-congress-in-center-of-armenian-media-attention/" rel="nofollow">here</a>.
</p>
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		<title>by: Onnik</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4782</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 22:14:47 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4782</guid>
					<description>Apologies, I got it wrong. The photograph wasn't taken in 2005 for New Internationalist. It was taken in 2006. Just checked my archives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Apologies, I got it wrong. The photograph wasn&#8217;t taken in 2005 for New Internationalist. It was taken in 2006. Just checked my archives.
</p>
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		<title>by: Onnik</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4778</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 18:53:50 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4778</guid>
					<description>Drowned in Ink also &lt;a href=&quot;http://drownedinink.livejournal.com/860039.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;has commentary&lt;/a&gt;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;I'm surprised not more of the politico-blogs I read are talking about the Armenian genocide controversy, since it looks like it has all the potential to turn into a tempest and possibly even one of the key political events in the decade. It also looks like it will turn into (yet another on the pile) tremendous humiliation for Bush, since it puts him in the position of trying to stop the government from calling an obvious act of genocide an act of genocide in order to prevent a possible obstacle to his precious pet war. This should be the deathblow to Bush's constructed myth that he is a leader who places principles above politics, or at least another kick to the corpse.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The full post is &lt;a href=&quot;http://drownedinink.livejournal.com/860039.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Drowned in Ink also <a href="http://drownedinink.livejournal.com/860039.html" rel="nofollow">has commentary</a>:</p>
	<blockquote><p>I&#8217;m surprised not more of the politico-blogs I read are talking about the Armenian genocide controversy, since it looks like it has all the potential to turn into a tempest and possibly even one of the key political events in the decade. It also looks like it will turn into (yet another on the pile) tremendous humiliation for Bush, since it puts him in the position of trying to stop the government from calling an obvious act of genocide an act of genocide in order to prevent a possible obstacle to his precious pet war. This should be the deathblow to Bush&#8217;s constructed myth that he is a leader who places principles above politics, or at least another kick to the corpse.</p></blockquote>
	<p>The full post is <a href="http://drownedinink.livejournal.com/860039.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>
</p>
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		<title>by: Armen Filadelfiatsi</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4777</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 18:21:52 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4777</guid>
					<description>What I meant was you can't &lt;i&gt;pay&lt;/i&gt; people to have a culture.  

That plus a fantastic photographer like Onnik, and art is awaiting.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>What I meant was you can&#8217;t <i>pay</i> people to have a culture.  </p>
	<p>That plus a fantastic photographer like Onnik, and art is awaiting.
</p>
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	<item>
		<title>by: Observer</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4776</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 16:34:15 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4776</guid>
					<description>Onnik - my compliments on excellent coverage of the issue again. And the photo is just great - I think I've said that already.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Onnik - my compliments on excellent coverage of the issue again. And the photo is just great - I think I&#8217;ve said that already.
</p>
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	<item>
		<title>by: Onnik</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4775</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 15:54:26 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4775</guid>
					<description>Well, I have to be honest, it was one of a few pics I took for New Internationalist. They published a full page pic with a little text in the July 2005 issue. It's also available online at:

http://www.newint.org/columns/exposure/2005/07/01/onnik-krikorian/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Well, I have to be honest, it was one of a few pics I took for New Internationalist. They published a full page pic with a little text in the July 2005 issue. It&#8217;s also available online at:</p>
	<p><a href='http://www.newint.org/columns/exposure/2005/07/01/onnik-krikorian/' rel='nofollow'>http://www.newint.org/columns/exposure/2005/07/01/onnik-krikorian/</a>
</p>
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		<title>by: Armen Filadelfiatsi</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4774</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 15:45:48 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4774</guid>
					<description>
I have to say, that is a wonderful photograph.  Now, who funded &lt;i&gt;that&lt;/i&gt;?

Nobody, but the people.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I have to say, that is a wonderful photograph.  Now, who funded <i>that</i>?</p>
	<p>Nobody, but the people.
</p>
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		<title>by: Onnik</title>
		<link>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4773</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Oct 2007 14:43:37 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://oneworld.blogsome.com/2007/10/11/genocide-notes-3/#comment-4773</guid>
					<description>Not a blog entry, but an opinion nonetheless, someone posted a link to an &lt;a href=&quot;http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6386625.stm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;interesting opinion piece by The Economist's Bruce Clark&lt;/a&gt; on a Cilicia.com post. While many Diaspora Armenians might disagree with the points made, it is still food for thought.

&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;em&gt;Turkey did not always deny the mass killing of Armenians. As the US House of Representatives prepares to vote on recognising the 1915 massacres as genocide, journalist and historian Bruce Clark looks at how and why Turkish attitudes have changed over the past 90 years.&lt;/em&gt;

&quot;The more foreign parliaments insist that our forebears committed crimes against humanity, the less likely anybody in Turkey is to face up to the hardest moments in history.&quot;

That, roughly speaking, is the message being delivered by Turkey's hard-pressed intelligentsia as the legislators in one country after another vote for resolutions which insist that the killing of hundreds of thousands of Ottoman Armenians in 1915 amounted to genocide.

[...]

In recent years, liberal Turkish scholars have expressed the hope that membership, or even prospective membership of the European Union, will give the country enough confidence to discuss the Armenian tragedy without threatening those who use the &quot;g-word&quot; with prosecution.

Sceptics may retort that in recent years, things have been moving in the opposite direction: the revised Turkish penal code and its preamble, adopted in 2005, make even more explicit the principle that people may be prosecuted if they &quot;insult Turkishness&quot; - a crime which, as the preamble makes clear, includes the assertion that the Ottoman Armenians suffered genocide.

It is certainly true that Turkish defensiveness - the sort of defensiveness which can treat open discussion as verging on treachery - has been running high since the 1960s when the Armenians round the world began lobbying for an explicit acceptance, by governments and parliaments, that their people suffered genocide in 1915.

A campaign of violence launched by Armenian militants in the 1970s, who mainly attacked Turkish diplomatic targets and claimed over 50 lives, raised hackles even higher. 

[...]

But in the midst of all this nationalist discourse, something rather important is often obscured, and there are just a few Turkish historians who dare to point this out.

The atrocities against the Armenians were committed by an Ottoman government, albeit a shadowy sub-section of that government.

There is no logical reason why a new republican administration, established in October 1923 in an act of revolutionary defiance of Ottoman power, should consider itself responsible for things done under the previous regime. 

[...]

The very fact that the Turkish republic bears no formal responsibility for eliminating the Armenian presence in eastern Anatolia (for the simple reason that the republic did not exist when the atrocities occurred) has given some Turkish historians a flicker of hope: one day, the leaders of the republic will be able to face up to history's toughest questions about the Armenians, without feeling that to do so would undermine the very existence of their state.

Fatma Muge Gocek, a Turkish-born sociologist who now works as professor in America, has said there are - or will be - three phases in her country's attitude to the fate of the Armenians: a spirit of &quot;investigation&quot; in the final Ottoman years, a spirit of defensiveness under the Turkish republic, and a new, post-nationalist attitude to history that will prevail if and when Turkey secures a places in Europe. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

The full item published by the BBC is &lt;a href=&quot;http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6386625.stm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Not a blog entry, but an opinion nonetheless, someone posted a link to an <a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6386625.stm" rel="nofollow">interesting opinion piece by The Economist&#8217;s Bruce Clark</a> on a Cilicia.com post. While many Diaspora Armenians might disagree with the points made, it is still food for thought.</p>
	<blockquote><p><em>Turkey did not always deny the mass killing of Armenians. As the US House of Representatives prepares to vote on recognising the 1915 massacres as genocide, journalist and historian Bruce Clark looks at how and why Turkish attitudes have changed over the past 90 years.</em></p>
	<p>&#8220;The more foreign parliaments insist that our forebears committed crimes against humanity, the less likely anybody in Turkey is to face up to the hardest moments in history.&#8221;</p>
	<p>That, roughly speaking, is the message being delivered by Turkey&#8217;s hard-pressed intelligentsia as the legislators in one country after another vote for resolutions which insist that the killing of hundreds of thousands of Ottoman Armenians in 1915 amounted to genocide.</p>
	<p>[&#8230;]</p>
	<p>In recent years, liberal Turkish scholars have expressed the hope that membership, or even prospective membership of the European Union, will give the country enough confidence to discuss the Armenian tragedy without threatening those who use the &#8220;g-word&#8221; with prosecution.</p>
	<p>Sceptics may retort that in recent years, things have been moving in the opposite direction: the revised Turkish penal code and its preamble, adopted in 2005, make even more explicit the principle that people may be prosecuted if they &#8220;insult Turkishness&#8221; - a crime which, as the preamble makes clear, includes the assertion that the Ottoman Armenians suffered genocide.</p>
	<p>It is certainly true that Turkish defensiveness - the sort of defensiveness which can treat open discussion as verging on treachery - has been running high since the 1960s when the Armenians round the world began lobbying for an explicit acceptance, by governments and parliaments, that their people suffered genocide in 1915.</p>
	<p>A campaign of violence launched by Armenian militants in the 1970s, who mainly attacked Turkish diplomatic targets and claimed over 50 lives, raised hackles even higher. </p>
	<p>[&#8230;]</p>
	<p>But in the midst of all this nationalist discourse, something rather important is often obscured, and there are just a few Turkish historians who dare to point this out.</p>
	<p>The atrocities against the Armenians were committed by an Ottoman government, albeit a shadowy sub-section of that government.</p>
	<p>There is no logical reason why a new republican administration, established in October 1923 in an act of revolutionary defiance of Ottoman power, should consider itself responsible for things done under the previous regime. </p>
	<p>[&#8230;]</p>
	<p>The very fact that the Turkish republic bears no formal responsibility for eliminating the Armenian presence in eastern Anatolia (for the simple reason that the republic did not exist when the atrocities occurred) has given some Turkish historians a flicker of hope: one day, the leaders of the republic will be able to face up to history&#8217;s toughest questions about the Armenians, without feeling that to do so would undermine the very existence of their state.</p>
	<p>Fatma Muge Gocek, a Turkish-born sociologist who now works as professor in America, has said there are - or will be - three phases in her country&#8217;s attitude to the fate of the Armenians: a spirit of &#8220;investigation&#8221; in the final Ottoman years, a spirit of defensiveness under the Turkish republic, and a new, post-nationalist attitude to history that will prevail if and when Turkey secures a places in Europe. </p></blockquote>
	<p>The full item published by the BBC is <a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6386625.stm" rel="nofollow">here</a>.
</p>
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